Started sewing....size chart confusion?

[Nenwing]

Hey all!
Well I've taken up a new hobby, sewing! I have made a few things already, basically purses, but I am going to try my hand at making clothing. I am starting with a simple dress. I took my measurments, and I am really confused! The chart has all these measurements (waist, hip, back, shoulder, elbow, bust, etc.) and each size (as in say 6,8,10,12) has the body measurements that fit within that size. Well, okay now this sounds funny, but I normally when I buy clothes, I wear a dress size 6. This fits me fine, and thats great and all, but these charts are confusing! I took all the measurments, and in some body measurements I'm like a size 14, and others I'm like a size 4, others a 10, others a 12. Ok so I'm like a mutant or something? I don't get how I'm all these different sizes, yet I fit in a dress size 6 fine. Can someone explain this to me?

[kimberlily]

How did you measure yourself? I always get someone else to measure me... because doing it yourself isn't as accurate. Take your measurements in your bra & underwear. Nothing else, or your measurements will be skewed.

Generally, when you make a dress, you are going to mostly go by your hip and bust measurements. The waist should also be taken into consideration. I never use all my measurements when looking up my size, because it confuses things too much

[Nenwing]

I measured just as they said, and had husband help me too, and they came out like that. I even measured in the undergarments that I was planning to wear under it. Maybe I just need to measure as I sew?

[RhainyC]

Sizing Chart Information 101

Ok, I am a retired professional seamstress and I can explain a bit of this for you.

When you purchase RTW (ready to wear) clothing, manufactures use what is known in the industry as *vanity sizing* Have you ever noticed that the more expensive the line of clothing is, the smaller the size you wear, number wise? That is Vanity Sizing.

When sewing, the pattern manufacturers also follow an industry standard. They have what is known to most as True Sizing. Your pattern size is based upon a set of measurements, and design ease, built into the pattern you have chosen.

So, bottom line is this, measure properly, and that means having a helper, if at ALL Possible, with the tape firmly, but not tightly around the area to be measured. Write these down, with the date you measured as well. That will help you to keep track for future sewing projects.

The main measurements you really need to use to buy patterns with are as follows:

Bust, waist, and hips.

Have the others, for fitting things better but don't worry about looking them up on the patterns at first. They just confuse the issue.

Another few tips...

Patterns for fitted dresses, should be bought to the closest Bust and Hip measurement. It is easier to take in the waist if needed, than to let out the bust/hip in a dress.

Patterns for fitted pants should be bought to the nearest waist measurement UNLESS, the hip measurement on the pattern is more than about 2 inches smaller than your actual hip measurement. Then it is best to buy the pattern by the hip measurement and take in the waist.

Loose fitting things should be bought by the measurement of the *fitted* part, such as skirts, by the waist, tops by the bust, dresses by the bust as well.

Ok, hmmm, hopefully I haven't forgotten anything...hope this helps. If not, feel free to ask any other questions...

Also, if you want to PM me or post your actual Bust, Waist and Hips measurements, and the pattern you are looking at, I can go see what size *I* would recommend you buy...if that helps?

[Nenwing]

Thanks Rhainy! Hmm, uhoh I didn't know there were "vanity" sizes, evil clothing companies!

[Tea Lady]

Don't be alarmed. I wear a 12 or a 14 in regular store-bought clothes. But in patterns I am often a 16, sometimes an 18. It's a little bit shocking to me, but I think I've gotten used to it. Actually I once needed to make something in a size 20! Also, it's easier to alter something to make it smaller when sewing, i.e. you can take in seams. But if you start off with a too-small pattern, there's nothing much you can do.

I started doing a technique that a lot of dressmakers do - making what is called a "toile" (pronounced twall). This is where you first make up the bodice of a dress (with or without the sleeves added) in cheap muslin and check it for fit before cutting into the fashion fabric. This has been such a big help to me, since i have broad shoulders and a widebody (!). I can change the bodice to fit me properly, plus I get a trial run, so to speak, on the making up of the bodice.

Tea Lady

[Nenwing]

Originally Posted by Tea Lady

Don't be alarmed. I wear a 12 or a 14 in regular store-bought clothes. But in patterns I am often a 16, sometimes an 18. It's a little bit shocking to me, but I think I've gotten used to it. Actually I once needed to make something in a size 20! Also, it's easier to alter something to make it smaller when sewing, i.e. you can take in seams. But if you start off with a too-small pattern, there's nothing much you can do.

I started doing a technique that a lot of dressmakers do - making what is called a "toile" (pronounced twall). This is where you first make up the bodice of a dress (with or without the sleeves added) in cheap muslin and check it for fit before cutting into the fashion fabric. This has been such a big help to me, since i have broad shoulders and a widebody (!). I can change the bodice to fit me properly, plus I get a trial run, so to speak, on the making up of the bodice.

Tea Lady

Tea Lady, that is exactly what I was going to do, buy the cheapest fabric possible and make it first out of that, then after I learn more on that then use the more expensive stuff!

Lol I was kinda shocked like "umm wha?" but I guess its that way for everyone. They think they are a certain size but in true sizing its not. I'm glad I did measure because it would have turned out too small for me and I would have been like okay what the hey? Maybe I should just make the whole thing in a size 12, then just go from there taking things in and trying it on a lot in between so I get the closest true fit. Its just on some of the measurements I am a true size 6, on others I'm like a true size 10, even 12. I guess this is where you throw out your pre-conceived ideas of your size and bite the bullet and accept the real size! It is deceptive though that the stores do that, I mean ok so those gals parading around in like size 1 are really more likely a 4 or even 6.

[smiles]

Thanks Tealady, thats a good idea. I'm a newbie to 'making clothes', though i've used my mother's sewing machine for mending and altering clothes and making easy stuff and i could use this tip.

I have a few questions, Tealady. Can you please help me with these.
Where can i get muslin? Is there some special needle i need to use with this material? So, i do the darts and seams and try this proto-type outfit for fit before cutting the main piece? should i do something else other than darts and seams?

Thanks!

[RhainyC]

Originally Posted by Tea Lady

Don't be alarmed. I wear a 12 or a 14 in regular store-bought clothes. But in patterns I am often a 16, sometimes an 18. It's a little bit shocking to me, but I think I've gotten used to it. Actually I once needed to make something in a size 20! Also, it's easier to alter something to make it smaller when sewing, i.e. you can take in seams. But if you start off with a too-small pattern, there's nothing much you can do.

I started doing a technique that a lot of dressmakers do - making what is called a "toile" (pronounced twall). This is where you first make up the bodice of a dress (with or without the sleeves added) in cheap muslin and check it for fit before cutting into the fashion fabric. This has been such a big help to me, since i have broad shoulders and a widebody (!). I can change the bodice to fit me properly, plus I get a trial run, so to speak, on the making up of the bodice.

Tea Lady

Tea Lady, yes I forgot to mention making up a test run...brain dump time! This is a very good idea for those who are new to sewing to try. Muslin or any stable woven fabric is the way to go with making up these things. I cannot for the life of me remember what we call them though, it is a different term than you used. (rattling brain in head to try to clear the fog) By using a stable woven fabric and making up a dry run of the pattern, you can find the problem areas when it comes to fit and construction.

[RhainyC]

A Wonderful resource for all those who sew, especially newbies:

http://www.sewing.org/enthusiast/html/e_learntosew.html

The site has TONS of wonderful advice, patterns, suggestions and tips.

[LovesHistory]

Originally Posted by smiles

Thanks Tealady, thats a good idea. I'm a newbie to 'making clothes', though i've used my mother's sewing machine for mending and altering clothes and making easy stuff and i could use this tip.

I have a few questions, Tealady. Can you please help me with these.
Where can i get muslin? Is there some special needle i need to use with this material? So, i do the darts and seams and try this proto-type outfit for fit before cutting the main piece? should i do something else other than darts and seams?

Thanks!

Muslin is a cheap cotton-like fabric. You can get it at any fabric store, many craft stores, and even some walmarts. for the toile, I like to use either muslin, or some cheap 'dollar a yard' scraps from the remnant table. One thing to keep in mind when purchasing toile fabric is that you want something that's semi-similar to the type of fabric that you're using. If you're using a knit fashion fabric, make your toile out of knit. if you're using heavy tapestry fabric, get some cheap heavy stuff from the dollar scrap pile. The reason for this is that different types of fabric stretch and fit differently. for example, a cut that will look good on you when made with a stretchy lyrca-type fabric will look awful when the same pattern is made out of velvet. I hope that makes sense and I haven't confused you.

Now, just a few words about myself - I am a costume sewer for a medieval re-enactment group. I am very knoweledgable about things like corsets, bodices, full skirts, embellishment, and period sewing techniques. If you ever need any help, please feel free to PM me.

One further suggestion - if you are unable to find an assistant to help you with your measurements, dont be afraid to go down to your local fabric store and ask for help. The attendents in fabric stores are often crafters/sewers themselves, and the store might even offer sewing classes. In any event, it's always been my experience that the staff are willing to help their customers.

[Tea Lady]

Smiles,

LovesHistory covered the muslin question. I always get mine at Joann's or Hancocks. One thing to keep in mind - the muslins come in varying widths. Some are as skimpy as 36" wide, which won't do for some patterns. Then there is 45" wide which works well for toiles. Then there are the muslins with widths of 96" and up for quilters, which have twice as much fabric as you might need. Sorry if this is sounding confusing. Basically all you have to do is go in and ask a clerk in the Joann's, Hancocks, or other fabric store, "Could you help me find some inexpensive muslin, 45" wide?" For a toile, it doesn't matter if it's 100% cotton or a blend of fabrics.

And as LovesHistory said, you should try and match the fabrics if you are using something really heavy or stretchy.

For needles, a Universal size 80 is good for medium weight fabrics. Schmetz is a good company (available at all fabric stores). There are confusing numbers on needle packages too. For example, on the Universal 80 package that I am looking at right now, it says:

Schmetz
Universal
130/705H 15x1H
80/12

Confusing, in't it? The important thing is that it is an 80. I have no clue what the other numbers mean! If you were working with a heavy fabric, you would use a 90. If using a light-weight fabric, you'd use a 70. The lighter the fabric, the smaller the size of needle you use.

Also, needles for knit fabrics are very different. You must use a "Stretch" needle for knits. These needles have a more rounded tip, so they slide by the knit fibers, rather than poking through them. This helps keep the knit fabric from running.

The 75 stretch needle package that I have in front of me says:

Schmetz
Stretch
130/705H-S
75/11

Again, the 75 is the number that matters. (I don't know if stretch needles come in size 80. All I have in my box is a 75 and a 90.)

Finally, yes you should put in the darts and seams. I sometimes put the sleeves on, due to my large-shoulder issue. But usually just making the bodice will do the trick. You don't have to do anyhing else unless you want to. I did do a collar on a toile once, because I had never made collars before. So it's not a bad idea. Some people make up an entire prototype beforehand. That's a great way to work out bugs ahead of time. But of course, it is very time-consuming.

Also, you can keep you toile for future reference. Or, what some do is this: If changes are made to the toile, such as needing to take in the side seams for a better fit, you can mark the changes right on the toile and make it your master pattern. Let's say you needed to take the waistline in a little bit. So you had pinned the toile so that the seams were in the right place. Before unpinning it, you would draw in the new stitching line (that is further in from what the pattern had). You would also need to re-draw where the seam allowance is to match the change (so the seam allowance would be 1/2" to 5/8" away from the new stitching line, depending on the seam allowance called for in the pattern). I hope that makes sense. It's hard to described!

Tea Lady

[RhainyC]

For more information on sewing needles/sizes/types check out this link:

http://www.sewing.org/files/GL-needle.pdf

It is awsome in explaining the details.

[MemSahib]

Although I am not a professional seamstress and have much to learn about fitting myself, I would like to assure you it is NOT AT ALL uncommon to measure a lot of different sizes. I am only 5' tall, but my measurements are all over the board. One of the most useful things I have learned is to do a Full Bust Enlargement. Now understand, I'm not all that big, but pattern companies are designing for models, I guess, who are clothes hangers — really, really skinny and not built much like most real women are. I choose about an 8 or 10 bodice to fit my narrow shoulders, but take the bust up to a size 14! A 14 positively swallows me in the neck and shoulders, so I've had to learn to do this.

Others can probably give you better advice on the mechanics of fitting, but I do want you to know you are not alone, Nenwing!

[Kathleen]

Originally Posted by LovesHistory

Muslin is a cheap cotton-like fabric. You can get it at any fabric store, many craft stores, and even some walmarts. for the toile, I like to use either muslin, or some cheap 'dollar a yard' scraps from the remnant table. One thing to keep in mind when purchasing toile fabric is that you want something that's semi-similar to the type of fabric that you're using. If you're using a knit fashion fabric, make your toile out of knit. if you're using heavy tapestry fabric, get some cheap heavy stuff from the dollar scrap pile. The reason for this is that different types of fabric stretch and fit differently. for example, a cut that will look good on you when made with a stretchy lyrca-type fabric will look awful when the same pattern is made out of velvet. I hope that makes sense and I haven't confused you.

Now, just a few words about myself - I am a costume sewer for a medieval re-enactment group. I am very knoweledgable about things like corsets, bodices, full skirts, embellishment, and period sewing techniques. If you ever need any help, please feel free to PM me.

One further suggestion - if you are unable to find an assistant to help you with your measurements, dont be afraid to go down to your local fabric store and ask for help. The attendents in fabric stores are often crafters/sewers themselves, and the store might even offer sewing classes. In any event, it's always been my experience that the staff are willing to help their customers.

I also do medieval reinactment. Modern sewing I find quite different though! but many things are the same. I like not having to follow a pattern and stuff for my medieval garb.

I use calico for my mock-ups. Put them on inside out so you can pin seems as needed, then mark these seems with a permant marker. If you wish transfer your new pattern to paper or material, but name and date it. "[you name] bodice from the [pattern name] [date here] is a good one. and store all the bits together, with that pattern if you can.

you really do need another person for this though, all the pinning. you can do it on your own, I've seen people do it on the net, but I can't, its far too akward. A dress dummy is good if you're going to do a lot of sewing, but I wouldn't recomend one if you're starting out, or only altering the occasional pattern.

So, yeah. Sew it in the larger size, then put it on inside out and get someone to help you pin the excess in where it needs it. Make sure you read the seam allowance too. Good luck